Is there a connection between Catholic and Modern Israel? What is the origin of the rapture theory? Does the rapture theory have any bearing on the politics of America or world politics? How does this theory affect the middle east conflict? There is no theological doctrine that has done more damage to the Christian cause then the doctrine of the rapture. This erroneous teaching, together with all the remaining links of the Futuristic School, form a chain that the prince of darkness has used to imprison multitudes of believers. Evangelical preachers and teachers like John Hagee, Chuck Missler, Morris Cerullo, Jack Hayford, Pat Robinson, Thomas Ice, Tim Lahaye, Hal Lindsey, C. Larkin, Mark Hitchcock, John Walvoord, Arno Froese, Charles Stanley, Joel Rosenberg, James Kennedy, Bennie Hinn, T.D. Jakes, C. Blake, Dewayne Rudd, Ken Hagin, Ken Copland, Creflo Dollar, James Dobson, J. Reyes, S. Lukens, Jerry Jenkins, John Ankerberg, Russell Bean, S. Keohane, Jack van Impe, Rod Parsley, Chuck Smith, Dave Hunt, Grant Jeffrey, Joe van Koevering, and a host of other national and international preachers have been misleading Christian believer by teaching this diabolical doctrine and even munipulating millions of followers to send money to build a third temple in Jeruselam.. These preachers may be sincere and think that they are doing Gods bidding but they are instruments of the Kabbalist. This doctrine is from the pits of the kingdom of darkness. TV evangelists like Hagee, TD Jakes, Joel Osteen, Kenneth Copeland, Ken Hagin and Jack van Impe and writers like Tim Lahaye and Hal Lindsey are pawns in a much wider conspiracy. The rapture theory was created as an anti-reformation tool and protestants have accepted it and made it their own. The rapture theory has more to do with the racist, arrogant and diabolical concept of British Israel than anything pertaining to the Kingdom of God. The rapture theory is from the pits of hell, created by Luciferians, and promoted by agents of the prince of darkness.
The Rapture theory is one of the biggest Hoax in history. How did these so called protestant christians get trick? What is the origin of the RAPTURE? What is the purpose of the dispensation theology? Who is behind it? Has it influence world events? I will give you some facts and let you decide.
During the 1500s, when the reformation was blossoming and the reformers identified the papacy as the anti-Christ, the Holy Roman Catholic Church fought back with a series of doctrines design to confused the people and keep them in the old church of traditions.
The Catholic Church counters the reformation at the Counsel of Trent.. Ignatius Loyola the founder of the Jesuits was commissioned by the Pope to develop a new interpretation of Scripture that would counteract the Protestant application of the Bibles Antichrist prophecies to the Roman Catholic Church.
Who was Ignatius Loyola?
In 1491 San Ignacio De Loyola was born in the Basque province of Guipuzcoa, Spain. His parents were Marrano Jews. As a young man he became a member of the Jewish Alumbrados (Illuminati) Order in Spain. As a cover for his crypto Jewish activities, he became very active as a Roman Catholic. (How the World Government Rules the Nations) He established theJesuit order. This secret society not only became a destructive arm of the Roman Catholic Church; it also developed into a secret intelligence service. Loyola, the Catholic hero and occult Illuminist who oversaw the torment and torture of thousands of Protestant and other groups who didnt agree with the Pope during the inquisition. The secret order he founded, the Jesuits, continues to this day to promote Communism, Zionism, dispensationalism, and the Illuminati agenda which include the total destruction of family, religion, government and the establishment of the New World Order.
A disciple of Loyola, Francisco Ribera (1537-1591), also a member of the Alumbrados took the challenge of defending the Catholic Church and in 1590, published a commentary on the Revelation as a counter-interpretation to the prevailing view among Protestants which identified the Papacy with the Antichrist. He fought against the concepts of the Protestant church which stated that the Catholic Church was the great whore of Revelation 17:1.
While the Reformers were pointing to Revelation 13 and declaring the Papacy as the Antichrist, Ribera explained that this Antichrist was some person who was to appear somewhere in the future. Here is a summary, of what Ribera said about the Antichrist:
1. The Antichrist is a political leader, and individual, who will appear some time in the future,
Who was Ignatius Loyola?
In 1491 San Ignacio De Loyola was born in the Basque province of Guipuzcoa, Spain. His parents were Marrano Jews. As a young man he became a member of the Jewish Alumbrados (Illuminati) Order in Spain. As a cover for his crypto Jewish activities, he became very active as a Roman Catholic. (How the World Government Rules the Nations) He established theJesuit order. This secret society not only became a destructive arm of the Roman Catholic Church; it also developed into a secret intelligence service. Loyola, the Catholic hero and occult Illuminist who oversaw the torment and torture of thousands of Protestant and other groups who didnt agree with the Pope during the inquisition. The secret order he founded, the Jesuits, continues to this day to promote Communism, Zionism, dispensationalism, and the Illuminati agenda which include the total destruction of family, religion, government and the establishment of the New World Order.
A disciple of Loyola, Francisco Ribera (1537-1591), also a member of the Alumbrados took the challenge of defending the Catholic Church and in 1590, published a commentary on the Revelation as a counter-interpretation to the prevailing view among Protestants which identified the Papacy with the Antichrist. He fought against the concepts of the Protestant church which stated that the Catholic Church was the great whore of Revelation 17:1.
While the Reformers were pointing to Revelation 13 and declaring the Papacy as the Antichrist, Ribera explained that this Antichrist was some person who was to appear somewhere in the future. Here is a summary, of what Ribera said about the Antichrist:
1. The Antichrist is a political leader, and individual, who will appear some time in the future,
2. He will arise in the last days and make a covenant with the Jewish nation,
3. He will rebuild the Temple of Solomon in Jerusalem, and restore animal sacrifices for the Jews, ruling there for 3 ½ years.
4. He will emerge as a world ruler, with power and authority over all nations, using miracles to back his claims, and subdue the church under him during a great tribulation.
Ribera misquoted Daniel chapter 9 in his attempt to shift the focus away from the Pope. He changed the word confirm to make in Dan 9:27, saying that the Antichrist would make a covenant with the Jews. The reference is actually to the Messiah, who confirmed the New Covenant, and then died for his people. It should not surprise us to see how the Roman church twisted Scripture to bolster a lie. This was the beginning of the Rapture doctrine design as an anti protestant tool. This doctrine lay dormant for over 300 years until a man who went by Rabbi Ben Ezra (Jesuit Priest Emmanuel de Lacunza) wrote a book in 1791 outlining the pre-tribulation rapture. The book was translated in English by Edward Irvin in 1827. A year earlier the librarian to the Arch Bishop of Canterbury, S.R. Maitland found Ribera writings, translated and published them in English. This doctrine was preached through out England and America and influenced political leaders and law makers. I will cover how the rapture doctrine shape the political landscape in Europe, America and the Middle East.
Is the rapture theory attributing to the crises in the Middle East?
A Blueprint for World Domination – NWO – Illuminati – Jesuits – Catholic – Zionism
The Two Popes - Pope Benidict XVI (White Pope) and Adolfo Nicolas (Black Pope)
The Vatican and The Jesuits
www.bibliotecapleyades.net/vatican/esp_vatican37.htm
"For we are opposed around the world by a monolithic and ruthless ... which is ultimately the Superior General (often nicknamed as the Black Pope, since he dresses in .... [17]), World Council of Churches (1937, 340 churches), Lutheran World ..The Most Powerful Man In The World ? “The Black Pope ...
warningilluminati.wordpress.com/the-most-powerful-man-in-the-wor...
Black Pope Adolfo Nicolas, Superior General of the Society of Jesus ... Jesuits The Black Pope, Adolfo Nicolas and his 6 generals control the “White Pope” PopeEvil Empire of Jesuit Futurism – Darby, Scofield, Jeffries, Assemblies of God, Pentecostal, British Israel
High ranking bilderberg mason spills the beans on his death-bed ...
unhypnotize.com/illuminati.../47662-high-ranking-bilderberg-mason...
4 posts - Feb 1, 2011
15 - The Illuminati are pushing the system for a One World Religion. The National Council of Churches (World Council of Churches) is financed ...Jesuits (IHS), Vatican & Papal Knights: Global Satanic Ritual Abuse ...
intheknow7.wordpress.com/jesuits-smom-knights-rcc/
Ordered by Jesuit Wlodimir Ledochowski (Black Pope No. ... Protestant leaders (THE VATICAN NEW WORLD ORDER click on my - the jesuit vatican ...
vaticannewworldorder.blogspot.com/.../vatican-new-world-order-jes...
Jun 8, 2012 – Above both Papal Knighthoods presides the Black Pope advised and aided by his ten Jesuit Assistants. ... Note the Pope IS A JESUIT TRAINED KNIGHT OF MALTA he's a front. ... Adolfo Nicolas ... American Assistant to General Nicolas ..... representative by Hillary Clinton, the wife of Jesuit-trained Bill ClintonThe Black Pope's scenario for World War 3 and destruction of the ...
theunhivedmind.com/wordpress/?p=18756
Jan 8, 2012 – If I was the Black Pope wanting to destroy both the Moslem world ..... invade—Federal Reserve: Jesuits Treachery at its Finest
prophecytimes.com/default.aspx?ctl=ctl_forum_topics.ascx&ID...
Jul 12, 2011 – We will now show that the Jesuits planned and carried out the sinking of ..... Lenin was trained by the Jesuit Order in Geneva Switzerland, it was ..... them Bill Clinton, who attended the Jesuit Georgetown University, the ... The New World Order is controlled by elite Jesuits and the Black Pope Adolfo Nicolas.Knighted Catholic Zionists
zomobo.net/Knighted-Catholic-Zionists
Bush Administration (Jesuit Controlled) 911 WAR LIES Exposed ..... is Jesuit controlled, Bush Senior a Knight of Malta ,Bill Clinton is Jesuit Trained, Hillary a 33th ... The Superior General of the Jesuits The Black Pope, Adolfo Nicolas and his 6 ...
Israel’s Link to the Rapture
Thousands expect Israel to play a major role in God’s future plan for earth. What is the Biblical evidence?
Many people today consider the restoration of the Jewish nation in Palestine to be a direct and dramatic fulfillment of Bible prophecy.Hal Lindsey’s The Late Great Planet Earth, a phenomenal best seller of the last few decades, and Jerry Jenkins and Tim Lahaye’s Lift Behind, along with Bishop T.D. Jakes declares that the end of the world will come within the lifetime of the generation that saw the founding of the Israeli state in 1948, hereby applying the words of Jesus: “This generation shall not pass, till all these things be fulfilled.” (Matthew 24:34)
Coupled with this fascination with Israel is a novel teaching regarding the return of Jesus, called the “secret rapture.” These books and many other speaks for many today who expect God secretly to take the “church” to heaven prior to the rebuilding of the Jewish Temple on its old site where the sacred Muslim shrine, the Dome of the Rock, now stands. According to this position, after the “church” is “raptured” to heaven, there will be seven years of the worst period of famine, bloodshed, and pestilence ever experienced by man. During this great tribulation the focus will be on God’s dealings with the Jews, who are again given the responsibility for the evangelization of the world.
According to secret-rapture preachers, the battle of Armageddon will climax the end of the seven-year tribulation as the nations of the earth take sides over the future of Israel. When mankind teeters on the brink of incinerating the world, Jesus will return gloriously and save man from self-extinction. At that time Jesus will set up a literal one-thousand-year reign on earth with Jerusalem functioning as the spiritual capital of the world.
Most evangelical periodicals and pulpits teach this view today, and to those who do not know better, it might appear that this prophetic scenario, known as pretribulationism, has been the traditional teaching of the Christian church since New Testament days. Nothing is further from the truth. Be not deceived.. Did the architects of the creation of modern day Israel have any thing to do with the development of the rapture theory? Where did the Rapture theology originate? Is the crisis in the Middle East and the war in the Iraq have anything to do with the erroneous rapture theory? Is there a master conspiracy at work? I will attempt to answer these and many more questions.. in my up coming blogs.
Jewish author, Arthur Koestler has published a 255 page book titled THE THIRTEENTH TRIBE which proves the Eastern European Jews are NOT related to Abraham, Isaac …
Are today’s Western Jews really ethnic, Semitic, Biblical Jews, or are most of them descendants of converted Khazars?...This compact, interesting book…examines tragic-ironic implications in [this question] for modern history…It should fascinate.” –Edmund Fuller, Wall Street JournalThe Thirteenth Tribe:
Arthur Koestler documents the Caucasian ancestry of Ashkenazim Jews.…TheThirteenthTribe. The Khazar Empire and its Heritage. Arthur Koestler. Mr. Koestler speculates about the ultimate faith of the Khazars and their impact on the racial composition and social heritage of modern Jewry. He produces a large body of meticulously detailed research in support of a theory that sounds all the more convincing for the restraint with which it is advanced. Yet should this theory be confirmed, the term “anti-Semitism” would become void of meaning, since, as Mr. Koestler writes, it is based “on a misapprehension shared by both the killers and their victims. The story of the Khazar Empire, as it slowly emerges from the past, begins to look like the most cruel hoax which history has ever perpetrated.
The vast majority of Jews in the world is of Eastern European – and thus perhaps mainly of Khazar – origin. If so, this would mean that their ancestors came not from the Jordan but from the Volga, not from Canaan but from the Caucasus, once believed to be the cradle of the Aryan race; and that genetically they are more closely related to the Hun, Uigur and Magyar tribes than to the seed of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob. Should this turn out to be the case, then the term “anti-Semitism” would become void of meaning, based on a misapprehension shared by both the killers and their victims. Maybe the two world wars and the Holocaust were pretext for the New Khazaria or Israel hoax.The story of the Khazar Empire, as it slowly emerges from the past, begins to look like the most cruel hoax which history has ever perpetrated.(Arthur Koestler,The Thirteenth Tribe, p. 17).
Old Khazaria existed from about 500 A.D. to about 1000 A.D.
Old Khazaria adopted the religion of Talmudic Judaism about 740 A.D.
Khazaria was reborn on May 14, 1948.
The most cruel hoax which man has ever perpetrated.
As long as New Khazaria exist…there will never be any peace in the Middle East. Modern-day Jewry is of Eastern European/Aryan descent and thus they are not Semitic. Let the truth be told everywhere.
Why should American Soldiers die to protect a Hoax?
The Khazars Kingdom, Gog and Magog, Jewish Khazars
www.apfn.org/thewinds/library/khazars.html
Khazar history shows they have no ancestry to Jews. ... fled westward to the region of the Danube in the Balkans and formed what is now modern-day Bulgaria.REFUTING MODERN ANTI-SEMITISM: The myth that all Jews are ...
www.redstate.com/.../refuting-modern-anti-semitism-the-myth-that-al...
Jul 3, 2010 – At their height, the Khazars and their tributaries controlled much of what is today southern Russia, western Kazakhstan, eastern Ukraine, ..Forbidden Knowledge - History of the Khazar Empire [Lecture by ...
truthtv.us/.../Forbidden-Knowledge---History-of-the-Khazar-Empire-...
Feb 17, 2012 – The remarkable, late Mr. Jack Otto expounds upon the forgotten history of the Khazars; absent a knowledge of which, most of what is going on ...Forbidden Knowledge - 1/4 - History of the Khazar Empire by Jack Otto | |
www.youtube.com/watch?v=SYglbcDs84kJun 8, 2011 - 15 min - Uploaded by IncreaseMyKnowledge
Forbidden Knowledge - 1/4 - History of the Khazar Empire by Jack Otto ... what is this guy's agenda? is he .. | |
The Illuminati and The History of ... Our Evil Banking System, Wars ...
beforeitsnews.com/alternative/2011/09/1124076-1124076.html
40+ items – ... History of the Khazar Empire ((( Lecture by Jack Otto ))) , ( A ) ...
| Illuminati and the creation of an evil Banking system, Wars, etc., False Jews ... |
| Because of the state the world is in today |
Khazar
www.reformation.org/khazaria.html
Here is the dictionary definition of ANTI-SEMITISM: ... The story of the Khazar Empire, as it slowly emerges from the past, begins to look like the most cruel hoaxA Reassessment of the Jewish DNA Evidence
www.jogg.info/11/coffman.htm
by E Levy-Coffman - Cited by 3 - Related articlesThere are many Jews who do not practice Judaism as a religion but define .... Probably for this reason, the Khazars, a people who lived in and around this area ...
British-Israel Answers its Critics
“The British-Israel theory is a dead, God-dishonouring, anti-Scriptural …… we don’t need to emigrate, evacuate or prepare for a Secret Rapture;
THE JESUITS AND THE PROTOCOLS OF ZION
THE JESUITS AND THE PROTOCOLS OF ZION
A Historical Critique of Dispensationalism, Zionism,
href="http://www.iconspedia.com/icon/reddit-logo-4367.html" style="color: #105cb6; text-decoration: underline;">History of British Israelism | Mistaken Identity
Getting in to more modern times, the Revival Centre position on British-Israel can be traced back to the one-time Assembly of God (’AoG’) preacher,
Daily Kos: A history of Dominion/”Kingdom Now”/Restoration Theology
In short, the British were “God’s Chosen People.” The British-Israel movement ….. FGBMFI is, much like the Assemblies of God itself and several other
The Assemblies of the World Council of Churches: On the Road to ...
www.youtube.com/watch?v=6Jk2yTnQ1eQ
Jan 10, 2012 – A look at the history of the World Council of Churches through its assemblies from ... The Illuminati & The New World Orderby makalesiFeatured ..Illuminati - Concluded
www.benabraham.com/html/illuminati_-_concluded.html
It was the World Council of Churches that helped Vietnam fall completely into the ... the Dragon (Illuminati-Communistic-Socialistic Movement) and her herald, .Christian Zionism, Left Behind and Rapture - Articles on the …
6th century AD) and the Venerable Bede’s Ecclesiastical History (735 AD) both saw theBritish as “the new Israel,” God’s chosen people, who were destined to
Who was Jesus?
Why is there no historic archaeological evidence of his existence?
Who wrote the Gospels?
Why were they written in Greek, rather than Hebrew or Aramaic?
How did the Christian religion come to be centered in Rome? Why were the
first Christian pope and earliest saints all members of the Flavius Caesar
ruling family?
History of Christianity -
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Who Was Serapis Christ - Who Invented The Serapis Cult
The Impact of Christian Zionism on American Policy and World Policy
British Israel, The Hidden Hand Behind The ‘Kingdom of God on …
… Billy Graham, Robert Shuller, Benny Hinn, Jack Van Impe, Jerry Falwell, … As subtitled in one of the chapters from The Union Jack below states– they …
Revelation 13 talks about 2 beasts. This video will identify the 1st beast, the Beast that comes out of the water. ...
The Rothschild’s are one of the top Illuminati bloodlines on the planet and they … TheRothschild’s, like the Illuminati in general, treat the mass of the Jewish …
The ILLUMINATI and the CFR
The ILLUMINATI and the CFR
illuminati families secret society freemasonry conspiracy theory biblical prophecy masonic …Illuminati. Illuminati NWO. Freemason Illuminati. Rothschild …
THE HOUSE OF ROTHSCHILD FINAL WARNING
… other name has become more synonymous with the Illuminati than the Rothschilds. … is believed that the Rothschild family used the Illuminati as a means to …
in QuickList
Vatican/Jesuit/Illuminati-Black Nobility occults control the world. A look in to the groups and secret societies that control the world. Also a look (more)
They started The Jesuits. They own Adam Weishaupt - paid hack of Rothschild who started theIlluminati.jesuits illuminati ormus talmud ecumenical
WHO CONTROLS THE WORLD. ILLUMINATI/JESUITS.pt3 NEW WORLD ORDERWHO CONTROLS THE WORLD. ILLUMINATI/JESUITS. NEW WORLD ORDER
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Rothschilds build Occultic Israeli Supreme Court. Future seat of AntiChrist??666 NWO AntichristIlluminati.
The Illuminati and the New World Order
Illuminati News: Inside Illuminati Lodge Skull and Bones 322 Yale
YouTube - Interview with ex-freemason and illuminati:Leo
YouTube - The Truth about Freemasons Secret Agenda part-1
YouTube - The Truth about Freemasons Secret Agenda part2
The Truth About the Rapture, Second Coming and The New World Order
Rev.21: 2 And I John saw the holy city, New Jerusalem, coming down from God out . than help spread the truth according to Gods Word.
New Vedic Order -KKK - White Nationalism - British Israel
He also was the founder of the KKK. He writes about the plan and goal of the Illuminati or the Freemasons. Albert Pike wrote about how the Illuminati see
Who founded The Church of God in Christ - Charles Fox Parham or Charles H. Mason?
Now, as we have mentioned before, the Church of God in Christ was founded by the late Bishop Charles Mason in 1897, the holiness denomination has preached righteousness, to be set a part from the world for years, but for the last twenty five years or more, the denomination has been caught up in becoming more like the secular world with their hip-hop gospel merging into the their churches nationwide through certain gospel artists who were raised in COGIC and have performed without shame; they have had descendants such as Bishop Yvette Flunder who is yet luring and influencing others to join her homosexual ministry while bragging of being taught under the late Bishop Walter Hawkins who had a gay and lesbian church in Oakland, CA., now under the leadership of his son who never even was ordained until his father died, allegedly; Bishop Carlton Pearson, also descendant of COGIC and an offspring of a dignitary preaches and negatively influences people to believe in his Gospel of Inclusion and along with all of these sinful behaviors, we have been covering issues of child molestation from ministers who cannot control their lusts and abstain from touching children. Now, this case of Pastor Ronnie Powe, Jr., the son of the Pastor of United Tabernacle Church of God in Christ could have been stopped, if he had not been given the position as youth pastor of his father’s church, obviously, like a lot of children of bishops and pastors, he is not called to be a minister.
Bloggers note:
Full Gospel is a branch of The Church of God in Christ. C.H. Mason alleged founder of COGIC received the name and doctrine from Charles Fox Parham (founder of KKK West Coast, founder of Assemblies of God, Grand-master of Freemason) Parham believed in Anglo Israelism or the Anglo European is God’s chosen people. Parham was also a disciple of Albert Pike who worshiped Lucifer as his God. Thus you have COGIC and Full Gospel teaching the Luciferian Rapture Doctrine.Although this doctrine is taught in Southern Baptist Churches and seminaries, it was not the teaching of traditional Black Baptist Convention Churches nor is it in harmony with the truth that emerge from the Protestant Reformation. It is a anti-protestant and anti-reformation doctrine. Parham was arrested for sodomy in Texas in 1907 and he promoted ministers who was favorable to his sexual orientation. Its no accident that so many of the COGIC ministers and bishops are like Parham.
Illuminati ministers will believe and teach Anglo Israelism (British Israel -Rapture) and they will promote the COGIC-Full-Gospel and Illuminati agenda. The question is who will make the best over-seer. The master ofthe plantation usually chose the Negro that was best suited in keeping the other Negros on the plantation in check.The master controlled what the HNIC thought and what he taught.What the master controller feared most was an independent thinking black man.
Azusa Street Timeline
www.spirithome.com/pentecostalist-history2.html
| February 1906 : A Holiness church without a pastor decided to hear out a preacher ... Rumors were already circulating that Parham was committing sodomy with ... up to the front, like Charles H. Mason, founder of the Church of God in Christ. |
Former KKK Leader now an ordained COGIC minister
Meet Johnny Lee Clary, a good ol’ boy from Oklahoma, proud white boy who is a minister for a black denomination… and oh yeah, a former imperial wizard for the Knights of the Ku Klux Klan. The founder of the KKK West Coast, Charles Fox Parham is also the founder of the COGIC. The name and the doctrine of the COGIC came from Parham. Parham was the highest ranking Freemason on the west coast. When C.H. Mason visited the Azusa conference which was sponsor by Parham. It was Parham plan to make William Seymour the head of the church that would promote Parham's doctrine (British Israel) but Parham and Seymour had a fallen out over Seymour baptising white people. When C.H. Mason arrived in town, Parham fell in love with him and decided to use Mason as the proxy for the new church which would be finance by the Rothschilds and Freemasons. C.H. Mason had the name that fit perfectly in Parham's agenda.In essence, the largest black church in the world was started by the KKK. The Church of God in Christ is actually a plantation with the bishop as HNIC.
Torch of Truth International: The Truth Behind The Rapture
Do You know.. You are infinitely valuable to Him. He needs you. You did not come into this world by accident. You are no mistake but you are here by Divine design and for a purpose that He has best suited for you and you alone to perform.. You are His first and best choice to do what He has design for you. God Knew you before you were born, He knows all about you. You may not realize your value yet, but He does. He knows that you are worth every bit of the price that He paid for you. There is no way to convince Him otherwise.. ( taken from Wayne Anderson book - Gods DNA)
The Inquisition - A Pictorial History..
Historical Overview Of The Inquisition - Part 1
History Of The Roman Catholic Inquisition - Part 2
The Spanish Inquisition - An Overiew
council of trent here is a selection taken from that meeting
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